Fishing sticks

Discussion in 'Tuna Talk' started by Cdux, Apr 11, 2018.

  1. Downrigga

    Downrigga Captain

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    Remember guy, 45# is at the strike. If im trolling i leave it at 45#. If i am soaking baits I back it off to 25# and move it back to the strike pin after the hook up. Didnt want to confuse you there. Also if you baby a giant it will usually get the best of you. They wont respond very well. Put the boots to it. If your gear is well maintained no reason not too.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2018
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  2. 30-06guy

    30-06guy Senior Member

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    Got it. I did get a little mixed up there. Everything you and mud said makes sense. Thanks for clarifying that.
     
  3. Downrigga

    Downrigga Captain

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    The PEI boats...you step on the boat and pretty much as soon as you leave the harbor you get all the bait you could ever want. They move the boat a 1/2 mile and in 5 minutes your hooked up. They want to be able to charge you a decent sum of money for the experience so they make sure you reach a happy medium with respect to time. They could put the boots to em and your trip would be over as fast as it started. When they pick the one or two fish they get to harvest each year, its usually on very big fish they have no choice but to hammer down hard. Cookie offers charters for the month of October up there. He and maybe Bruce Brothers, highly recommended.
     
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  4. Downrigga

    Downrigga Captain

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    Just my opinion, I feel that 12# is way to low. BFT are not going to nibble on your bait. They are big creatures. Does not mater if its a stick bait or a live bait, same treatment. They will inhale your bait along with quite a bit of water. A good bend in the rod sets the hook. Low drag setting is not going to give you the bend you want for a well positioned deep hook set. Not every fish runs when it eats. Some don't even realize they are hooked. Sometimes, it takes few minutes for them to figure out something it wrong. Some you think must be a small for the first several minutes and then your reel screams like hell. Think about a stick bait. You want the bait to crush and expose the hook. A circle hook almost 10 times out of 10 will end up in the hinge. If the fish can pull the bait away with a low drag setting its going to take longer to separate the bait from the hook and you could miss the hook-up or get a poor hook placement. Your line is rated much higher than the max drag setting of your reel. Don't worry about it breaking if your gear is working properly. Chances are much higher of losing a fish from pulling a hook during the fight or from line chafe. Make the rod bend, keep it bent at all times, and get the fish to the boat. I'm sure others will chime in and share some knowledge. The tuna thread does not get enough posts in my opinion so its good to see folks posting in here.
     
  5. Massbaytuna3

    Massbaytuna3 Member

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    A different perspective: With circle hooks (inline especially) I am a fan of light light drag at the hookup; especially on non-weighted floaters. As the fish starts making that first big run I gradually push it up and end up fighting at 45lbs. I like the line to work its way into the hinge and then slide the circle hook into place as I add pressure.

    I have fished pretty much every circle hook out there: Trokars, Demon PCs, Super Mutus, etc, etc. I have found that my best catch rates with circles have been with light drag at the hookup. Too much drag and I have pulled hooks right off that bat, or broken tips because the hook never had a chance to settle in the hinge; the tip doesn't penetrate fully (that's what she said...).

    One thing that I like to do with circles is use a slightly bigger crotch loop; just enough so the hook can swing free. I think it helps the circle do its job.

    I really honed in on fishing circles up in Canada (and down in MA). Been fortunate enough to fish with the Bruce Brothers for the last 9 years. Amazing people. It is an awesome fishery, although it's definitely changing. 100% having to fish harder up there the last couple of years. We have been making 40 mile runs some days to stay on the herring.

    As far as J Hooks; I am fishing 30lbs at the hookup. I want that hook to set ASAP and I have found that I get more hinge hookups with heavier drag with Js. I also like to fish J's in my stick baits. I feel more confident that even if the hook doesn't come completely clear from the bait that at least some part of the hook will catch in the fishes mouth.

    Cool to see everyone's point of view/ experience!

    -Bryan
     
  6. 30-06guy

    30-06guy Senior Member

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    Everything you said makes sense. I was just given the advice to start low on the drag and slowly increase it to set the hook. Massbaytuna3 said it just like I was told from Captain Scott Lewis. Start way low on the drag and slowly increase it to pull the hook back thru the fish and set it in his jaw. I know that Captain Lewis was a fan of the Mustad perfect circle hooks. Are you using offset circles or non offset? I like your idea of getting the fish to hook himself right from the get-go. Don't give him a chance to miss the hook. Obviously two different schools of thought and I will probably try both and see what works for me . Like you said earlier that there would be other opinions on the subject and none of them would be wrong. I do agree with you about putting the hammer to the fish once he's hooked up. The reason I was going to fight' um at a lower drag setting was I read on Chubby's web page that you were less likely to burn a fish bringing them in at 28-30 pounds of drag. The theory is that the fish won't burn if you play them out slow. I know this thread has gone way off the original topic. I will start a new one about care of fish. I have a few questions about that as well if anyone wants to share some pointers. I will say that I'm with you on putting the hammer to them and get them to the boat as quickly as possible. A fish in the boat that was fought hard and landed is worth more than one that chewed thru the leader and swam off.

    Rob
     
  7. 30-06guy

    30-06guy Senior Member

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    You described the start low and slowly increase until the hook sets just the way it was described to me by Capt. Lewis from North Lake PEI. You said that you have tried just about every circle hook out there. Do you have one that is a favorite? Also you mentioned about using J hooks. I guess I took it for granted that most everyone was using circle hooks for bluefin. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience. I agree it is nice to see other people's experience and opinions.

    Rob
     
  8. Old Mud

    Old Mud Captain

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    Rob, when you say "Everything you said makes sense" you are absolutely right. There are many right answers to how to get it done. Most are from experience from a number of different sources. (Hopefully from experience ) lol. Personal likes and dislikes if you will. It's all good info and some of us have been through it before and has not always worked OR has !!. I know i couldn't type enough to tell you what works for me and why i think it does. What i have tried etc., etc. You just have to try to sort it all out and go with what works for you.

    One thing i can say is this. Whatever you do don't get hung up on any one thing and stay with it without catching fish. Some things change through the years and you have to have a lot of stuff stored in that grey matter to help you out. Don't Change just for the sake of Change. When you have or think you have a reason then Change, you will thank yourself. !! :)

    Ok now one more thing i would like to say is I am NOT a big fan of fighting a fish at 28-30 # drag. imho anything much more than an hour or so your odds go up trying to land a big fish. As far as burning out your fish yes it can happen BUT !! In the last few years it hasn't made a difference if you swim him, bring him back to life with a jaw hook before killing him, Bleeding him properly, Using a straw down the spine or Icing him down in your $250. bag. Your NOT getting $20.00 for your fish !!!.

    This is Not Reality TV but it IS reality. $ 3-5 a # You can just haul him aboard gut him and you won't get any more even with the rice paper. :)
     
  9. 30-06guy

    30-06guy Senior Member

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    I totally understand what you are saying about finding out what works for me. I love to hunt Whitetails and have killed a bunch over the years (some big ones to). There is nothing better than first hand experience with learning how to do something. My father used to tell me that if I was smart I would learn from my mistakes, and if I was really smart, I would learn from someone else's. I know you guys have busted your ass and spent a lot of time figuring out what works for you and what doesn't. And I appreciate you sharing that with me and giving me a head start. Hell just finding out what doesn't work is worth as much or more than what does.

    I also know what you mean about change. It's the same thing with hunting. When everything you have done in the past doesn't work out you need to figure out what does. That's part of the game.

    As far as the money is concerned, I get that the prices aren't what they were in years past. I would like to take as best care of my fish as I can, even if it doesn't make a difference in the price. And as for the reality TV, I don't watch it. I don't even have cable. ( I spend all my time on DEBF) :D I've seen a couple of episodes on line and that was plenty for me. I know that the prices you see on there are BS. Thanks again for all your help.

    Rob
     
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  10. Downrigga

    Downrigga Captain

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    Bryan I remember you guys would post about some epic trips in PEI. It is a pretty special place. Nice to see what can be achieved when you manage fisheries properly. We are luck we get some spill over along the hague although we have found a way to ruin that area as well.
     
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  11. Massbaytuna3

    Massbaytuna3 Member

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    For small/medium baits I have been fishing 7/0 and 8/0 OS Trokar Circles. Mostly on herring. Pretty light hook and the OS version gives you a lot of tip to shank distance.

    For larger mackerel I have been fishing the 8/0 Trokars and sometimes the 10/0 4x OS Demon Perfect Circle (Canada hook). The hookset with the Demons when done right is 99.9% perfect every time. Important to get the 4x. The 3x will open up over time. They are a big hook though...Good bluefish hook too.

    For Js I have been fishing Owner Gorillas and VMC Dynamics. On the kite I only fish 8/0 - 10/0 Jobus.

    Like I mentioned before, I really like circles on non-weighted floaters/livies.

    Just do what you are comfortable with. It takes a lot of practice to be able to "come tight" two different ways essentially. I always make sure everyone is in the loop on wait bait has what type of hook at any given time.
     
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  12. 30-06guy

    30-06guy Senior Member

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    Thanks for the reply. It gives me a bit more food for thought.

    Rob
     
  13. tuna_fan

    tuna_fan Captain

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    I am going through a hook crisis right now - I don't really love any of them, seems that each has had problems for me. Owners have either broken or rolled the tip, I think the chemical sharpened tip is actully TOOK sharp and if you hit an exceptionally hard spot in the mouth or jaw, the tip rolls. Mustad Demons either open or pull. Trokars are nice, but I get a hinge hook maybe 1/2 the time with them, otherwise I get a lot of lip hooks...not ideal and i wonder how many pulls I'm getting from lip hook ups....I have not tried the non-OS for trokar, I am hoping the non-OS will help with the hinge hooks.
    Going to go back to Gamakatsu J's this year and see what happens - seem like a nice simple hook and honestly not sure why I got away from them in first place (over 15 years ago) - maybe pulled hooks (my logs are not as good as Mud :) )...the VMC 7360 also seems like a nice hook, although the 10/0 (their biggest size) actually looks a tad small to me...
    I even found some weird stainless J hooks with rings , longline style I may try...i know, not very responsible.
    Bottom line for me is...my hook brand and type selection varies greatly day to day...and I am quite wishy washy on which one I choose for any given day...frustating myself and possibly over thinking it.
     
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  14. Old Mud

    Old Mud Captain

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    These are some hooks that won't break. :) I'm sure you have seen these before.

    . s-l500.jpg
     
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  15. tuna_fan

    tuna_fan Captain

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    Yes! found something very similar...my only concern is BENDING them...I have no real evidence trying them...but would hate to have to learn the hard way that you cant push past 40# with this type of hook:)
     
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  16. Downrigga

    Downrigga Captain

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    best hooks going mud!
     
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  17. Old Mud

    Old Mud Captain

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    Uh maybe you are looking at different hooks than what i posted. There is NO WAY any fish or person is going to break them. They are BIG and rugged. Aka Jap hooks, sorry not don't mean to be not PC but it's the only name i know them by. And the name they were sold by way back. Handline hooks, Way before Penn 130's or even the Penn 14/0.:) If you want i can send you a couple.


    Yeah and i know they still sell them although not everywhere.
     
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  18. 30-06guy

    30-06guy Senior Member

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    Don't they size them different? Like #35 and #40 instead of 8/0 or 10/0. I know a place that used to carry them but I don't know if they still do. I will check next time I'm there and if they do I will pick up a few to try.
     
  19. Old Mud

    Old Mud Captain

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    Yes they don't size them like 9/0 or 10/0 etc. Find some old guy with handlines and you will find those. :)
     
  20. tuna_fan

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    The ones I picked up have the same eye, and ring, but a curved body (not angled) and a slight offset, with short shank. I tested them with pliers just to see if they would SNAP or BEND with pressure. Seems like most of the major brand hooks will break after bending slightly, like they are heat forged, which takes away the bending/memory properties, but makes them more brittle. These stainless ones definitely will bend with pliers...but I don't think they are ever going to break, too malleable...
     

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