My first boat project

Discussion in 'Downeast Projects and Boat Building' started by Jerzy54, Dec 16, 2016.

  1. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    Hatteras, great boat lots of luck with the project.
    In my project I'm finding more and more stuff to do. It's little bit overwhelming for the first project.
    I still have to take the cabin apart after Christmas and see what I am in to.
     
  2. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    I would like to get your opinions should I and how to support the hull for the transom/stringers replacment. I was thinking to leave her on the trailer and maybe to support front of the bow to the trailer frame as per attached photo.
    I won't be taking top off the boat.

    Your suggestions?
     

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  3. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    No hits on my previous post. Here is another question. Right now my stringers are made from some kind of wood. It looks like it is 2"x 8" size. I was reading, that Douglas Fir wood is the recommended to fiberglass over it, but today on another forum guys were saying that fiber glassing wood is bad idea due to natural expansion of the wood itself and possibility of cracking fiberglass.

    Previous owner of my boat said that, the hull is made from the Fiberglass reinforced plastics. Is this material friendly to use with today's epoxy resins?
     
  4. Genius

    Genius Captain

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    not to be crass, but if the questions you are asking make me unsure if your ready to take on a project like this.:confused:

    the vast majority of boat out there use wood stringer systems encapsulated in glass. Yes, polyester resin to wood bond is not the best but...in the case of stringers (just my thoughts) it is enclosed within it and not relying on a pure "grip" bond. Epoxy can be used with a lot of different materials and has a tenacious grip/bond.

    GRP, glass reinforced plastic is the fancy name for fiberglass on the street.:cool:
     
  5. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    Thanks Genius for your replay, I think every task can be tackled even if someone has a lack of experience.
    In my opinion there aren’t wrong questions, just wrong answers. This forum is full of experienced knowledgeable people like yourself that can help guys like me. I’m not afraid to do this job, I just want to make as little mistakes as I can. I know this is a big job, but with little advice from guys like you anything can be done.

    Happy New Year.
     
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  6. ArchHibb

    ArchHibb Captain

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    If I am understanding the pictures correctly, this was an I/O setup and the aft engine room is separated from the cockpit by a bulkhead, but the stringers are continuous from stem to stern, yes?

    The cockpit clearly has a significant grid system in it which appears to be tied into the stringers. Is it all painted wood? Are there limber holes throughout the grid? In order to encapsulate the stringers in fiberglass, you will need to encapsulate the entire grid also. Otherwise, moisture could enter a transverse grid member and then migrate into a stringer via the connection.

    Depending on the overall condition of the grid, you might consider forgoing the fiberglass and focusing on wood repairs and using a high-performance (ex. Epoxy) paint to seal everything. Wood is super easy to work and inexpensive which is good because the paint is not. Sealing the grid is as easy as flooding it with paint and removing any excess.

    Regarding the stringer replacement, plywood is not the preferred choice because it can't hold fasteners through it's edge. You mention investigating outboard power. If going that direction, you'll likely need to reinforce the transom and definitely need to tie it into your new stringers. Solid wood stringers will make that easier.
     
  7. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    Thanks ArchHibb for your suggestions. Yes it was the Volvo Penta I/O and I decided to stick with it for now at least. I have too many things to worry about it for the novice like me.
    Yes there is aft engine bulkhead and stringers are running from the transom to the bow.
    The all grid was encapsulated in the fiberglass, but it is completely rotted and has to go.
    There are limber holes for draining. I want to take time with this project and do this right and better then original build. I’m still in process of demolition. She has a wooden keel which is leaking into the hull and I need to take care of it, also spray rails need to be reattached and seal as well. I need to take outboard transom mount and see transom condition and what needs to be done there. I think if transom needs to be replaced it will be the most difficult task for me.
    Sorry for the long replay.
     
  8. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    Hi guys, it has been a six month and after crazy long winter and a little time to do anything, I would like to share status of my project.

    First as I expected there was a total rot to the stringers and bulk heads. I measured everything and removed as careful as I could to preserve some pieces for the

    templets for new stringers and bulks. As for today I still have to replace a transom. It has some rot, but at this stage it is wise to go for it and make new one.

    I decided to keep existing engine. I did complete rebuild and is almost ready. I'm just waiting for the cylinder head to have exhaust ports welded due to salt water corrosion.

    I found a lot of strange things about this boat. The stringers were built from 2x pieces of wood and were made in three to four pieces. I will try to do it in two sections. First running from

    the helm bulk to the transom and the other in the cabin from helm to the bow. I think I will use a Douglas fir for the stringers and some bulks and also I will use 3/4 marine plywood for

    the transom, engine compartment bulk and the helm bulk. Here are some progress photos.
     

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  9. goin4broke

    goin4broke Captain

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    Good project you have going there. Somehow I missed it till now. I really admire how you are going about this. As far as the stringers go, and I am no expert on wood, I would consider using marine plywood for the stringer replacement. A laminated stringer of say 2 pieces of 3/4" MP bonded together would be stronger than a single piece of lumber. More expensive and perhaps overkill yes, but you can scarf 8 foot pieces to make a solid stringer fore to aft. Just my thoughts about how I would go about it. Or if your willing to spend a few dollars more go coosa and never have to worry about it. As far as support under the hull while your replacing all this the more the better. Good luck.
     
  10. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    Thanks for an encouragement and advice. I thinking to take the boat off the trailer and put it on the blocks/stands. I need to have an access to the bottom to install a new skeg keel that I have fabricate.
    In your opinion is it better to do the stringers first while the boat is on the trailer and latter take it off to install the keel or take it off now and do whole job? Here are todays photos.
     

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  11. goin4broke

    goin4broke Captain

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    Since you scrapped the stringers keep it where it is and brace up so not to distort the hull. Keep in mind you may have 2 to 3 hundred pounds dancing around inside as you reconstruct your stringers. Not saying your fat as I never met you but you may need an extra person setting them in place. Not sure I can tell from the pics what is it that was in between the stringers? It looks like built up glass or something?
     
  12. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    You right about everything, there was a lot of resin poured in in some point for some reason. This is my first project and I finding out things about this boat and the building process. This boat in one point was patched up somehow for some reason. Today I took off the inner transom skin and found out there is a lots of rot also except in the small area in the middle top portion of the transom, where the plywood was replaced and is in pristine condition. I am trying to figure out how to do this task, because I have no way to remove top side. Also you right about my fat ass it is always gets in the way. LOL. stringer.jpg
     
  13. goin4broke

    goin4broke Captain

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    Well this is what happens when you pull the first layer off the onion. The good thing is you'll know every inch of her when your done. I haven't the foggiest clue why they poured resin into the hull. I hate to say it but you my have to get rid of it in order to get a good bond for your new stringers. On the transom issue, personally, I've never done one and never read about one with a cover like the one you have. Maybe someone else can chime in on it.
     
  14. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    It make two of us. Lets hope someone did this in the past. Thanks.
     
  15. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    I just need some advice about amount the fiberglassing material you guys think I would need for this project.
    I would be using 1.5 oz. CSM and 1708 mat. What kind a resin should I use? Epoxy resin or polyester resin. How about West system.
    What are you suggestion?
     
  16. Brooksie

    Brooksie Captain

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    Epoxy is going to cost you a lot more 3-4X but it has many advantages and 5X the secondary bonding strength is the one you need most inyour case. Further, if you end up using wood for stringers & grid epoxy will completely exclude water whereas poly will not. Try U.S. Composites for your FG materials/ resins. Very reasonable and great products. I would mention that there have been many high quality boats built with hollow stringers & grids (laid up over cardboard or foam forms) you need more glass yes, but easy to shape and no future rot worries. Stick it down with hot melt, and glass away. Vinylester resin might be a good choice too, it has better secondary bonding properties than polyester, maybe 2X.
     
  17. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    Thanks, Brooksie, great advice.
     
  18. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    Today I got back rebuild head with welded exhuast ports. This mechanic is the best marine guy I know.
    Can you guys recomend any epoxy and other supplies and where is the best price. Should I stick with West System?
    Any addvice?
     

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  19. goin4broke

    goin4broke Captain

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    As far as epoxy goes I use Mas. they make a variety of cure time and viscosity which are user friendly and typically cheaper than the name brands. Any epoxy, regardless of who makes it is basically the same formula. Find a supplier local to you (except West Marine) where you can P/U. Shipping can be a budget buster.
     
  20. Jerzy54

    Jerzy54 Member

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    Good point, shipping could be expensive.
     

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