Are scuppers mandatory?

[leaky]

Could you not build a slight crown in your deck with gutters outboard and scuppers/drains in the aft corners?
Perko makes some nice ones with rubber flaps to keep inflow to a minimum.

Issue is these hulls, being small as they are, it's tough to put the deck high enough to avoid letting water in when people shift weight around, while low enough so little stumble won't put you in the drink.

Flaps, ok sure, but a crown isn't gonna help when one fat guy makes it list.

 

[Diesel Jerry]

Issue is these hulls, being small as they are, it's tough to put the deck high enough to avoid letting water in when people shift weight around, while low enough so little stumble won't put you in the drink.

Flaps, ok sure, but a crown isn't gonna help when one fat guy makes it list.

Did you just call Jeff fat?

 

[John Allin]

Rule is: No fat guys on the rail.
Must stay in, or on, centerline.
Problem solved.

 

[John Allin]

And remember that the best pump is a scared man with a pail…!

 

[xbskt]

So how much crown is enough?
1/2" from centerline?

 

[John Allin]

1/2” may be fine if the boat sits level. All you really need is enough to ensure water runs off and into the drains. 1/2” over 4’, an 8’ beam, is lots more than 1/2” over 6’, for a 12’ beam. You may be surprised at how little you need.

 

[John Allin]

Simplest way to see what is looks like - and make templates - is to lay an 8’ batten on your bench, pin the ends and push the center up 1/2” or 1”, what ever you’re looking for, and see if it’s workable for you. As long as the batten has no hard spots, you’ll have a perfect arch

 

[Bert1962]

I

I raised the deck on my pointer. I had to fill in the old scuppers and and drill new ones. We glassed in pvc pipe so I have rubber flaps outside and I can screw in caps on the inside. I wouldn't trust a pump. Good luck with your project.

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PVC with screw in plugs is idiot proof

 

[CBTHREE]

I think "no size fits all". Bilge pumps do work but for me, I like having scuppers. If you have a reliable bilge pump system, I see nothing wrong with that but the down side as has been mentioned repeatedly, they don't work without power. I was invited to go fishing several years ago by a friend. I met him at the dock with engines running. I noticed his bilge pump was running & constantly cutting on & off. I told him & he said everything was fine & the bilge pump cutting on & off was caused by a wiring problem. We no sooner got to his fishing spot in about 200' of water when he freaked due to blue water in the cockpit. He got on the radio to the coastguard & hollered "Mayday". I don't know if the bilge pump quit working or was just overwhelmed by the leak. I don't recall any scuppers. The leak was apparently caused by too much weight on the outboard platform. It was an older boat & he had two new 225 hp engines on it. Beside being old, I don't think it was designed for that much weight. He tried getting the water to run out by powering up & moving forward which I think would have worked had he taken it easy. Water will generally run out of the drain if you get the boat moving but he gave it full power which bogged the engines & resulted in getting them drowned out. I won't bore you with the rest of the story but the coast guard showed up & a nearby fishing boat came over to render assistance. The coastguard towed the boat in but the insurance company totaled both engines! That brings to mind the quote,"you can't fix stupid!"

 

[Diesel Jerry]

I think "no size fits all". Bilge pumps do work but for me, I like having scuppers. If you have a reliable bilge pump system, I see nothing wrong with that but the down side as has been mentioned repeatedly, they don't work without power. I was invited to go fishing several years ago by a friend. I met him at the dock with engines running. I noticed his bilge pump was running & constantly cutting on & off. I told him & he said everything was fine & the bilge pump cutting on & off was caused by a wiring problem. We no sooner got to his fishing spot in about 200' of water when he freaked due to blue water in the cockpit. He got on the radio to the coastguard & hollered "Mayday". I don't know if the bilge pump quit working or was just overwhelmed by the leak. I don't recall any scuppers. The leak was apparently caused by too much weight on the outboard platform. It was an older boat & he had two new 225 hp engines on it. Beside being old, I don't think it was designed for that much weight. He tried getting the water to run out by powering up & moving forward which I think would have worked had he taken it easy. Water will generally run out of the drain if you get the boat moving but he gave it full power which bogged the engines & resulted in getting them drowned out. I won't bore you with the rest of the story but the coast guard showed up & a nearby fishing boat came over to render assistance. The coastguard towed the boat in but the insurance company totaled both engines! That brings to mind the quote,"you can't fix stupid!"

So one bilge pump that was faulty. That is an owner neglect problem more than a self-bailing vs bilge pump problem. That’s not even digging into why the boat was sinking issue.

 

[Genius]

I think "no size fits all". Bilge pumps do work but for me, I like having scuppers. If you have a reliable bilge pump system, I see nothing wrong with that but the down side as has been mentioned repeatedly, they don't work without power. I was invited to go fishing several years ago by a friend. I met him at the dock with engines running. I noticed his bilge pump was running & constantly cutting on & off. I told him & he said everything was fine & the bilge pump cutting on & off was caused by a wiring problem. We no sooner got to his fishing spot in about 200' of water when he freaked due to blue water in the cockpit. He got on the radio to the coastguard & hollered "Mayday". I don't know if the bilge pump quit working or was just overwhelmed by the leak. I don't recall any scuppers. The leak was apparently caused by too much weight on the outboard platform. It was an older boat & he had two new 225 hp engines on it. Beside being old, I don't think it was designed for that much weight. He tried getting the water to run out by powering up & moving forward which I think would have worked had he taken it easy. Water will generally run out of the drain if you get the boat moving but he gave it full power which bogged the engines & resulted in getting them drowned out. I won't bore you with the rest of the story but the coast guard showed up & a nearby fishing boat came over to render assistance. The coastguard towed the boat in but the insurance company totaled both engines! That brings to mind the quote,"you can't fix stupid!"

see, bad scuppers sink boats

 

[Shor2832]

I put scuppers in my Tripp project and haven’t had any problems. I close the doors when I launch.

 

[xbskt]

I put scuppers in my Tripp project and haven’t had any problems. I close the doors when I launch.

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Now that is what I am talking about. Those that don't understand what I am talking about can see why I don't want to put the scuppers at the corners. You moved them inward which makes them much more practical IMO.
No aft well I see. Bilge pump aft inside that hatch I assume?
Thanks for posting.

 

[Diesel Jerry]

Now that is what I am talking about. Those that don't understand what I am talking about can see why I don't want to put the scuppers at the corners. You moved them inward which makes them much more practical IMO.
No aft well I see. Bilge pump aft inside that hatch I assume?
Thanks for posting.

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Jeff refresh my memory. Are you going with a bracket or no bracket on this?

 

[John Allin]

see, bad scuppers sink boats

bad scuppers don't sink boats....bad people sink boats.

 

[xbskt]

Jeff refresh my memory. Are you going with a bracket or no bracket on this?

No bracket. Maybe the next project. Still learning so keeping it simple.

 

[MAArcher]

I advocate it's a solution, move plugs from transom to deck drains, or vice versa. But you better not screw that up and have both open at the same time with a low deck. That would sink a boat.

Why attempt to build a self bailing deck that you know just doesn't work right for the next guy? It's a compromise making a self bailing deck, reduces cockpit depth - requires lots of concern over waterline and pitch.

A boat designed around pumping water is gonna be a better boat than one designed around poorly self bailing where you pump water because the former doesn't work right IMO.

Why would having scuppers and bilge open at the same time sink a boat?

 

[Genius]

Why would having scuppers and bilge open at the same time sink a boat?

because bilge pumps can't pump an ocean out

 

[buzzbay71]

I have a Tripp 22 w/ cuddy, outboard model and yes, the deck can get a bit wet in the corner by a scupper when someone stands in the corner of the gunwale and transom, but it depends on the weight distribution of other people and gear. We just adapt by loading things in the stern that can get wet bottoms like plastic bins and coolers. I pushed the limits or exceeded them this summer by shuttling six adults, two kids, a dog, and all food and gear for a week of vacation and we definitely had a wet stern and I wouldn't have done it in rough water. I have one bilge pump in the deepest part of the bilge just forward of the door into the cuddy.

Crowning the whole deck sounds like a lot of work--what if you did a 1/2" height increase (flat), but retained the old scupper locations with a "gutter" along the transom that had a crown in the bottom of the gutter (the center of this "gutter" could be nearly or even at deck height)?

 

[CBTHREE]

So one bilge pump that was faulty. That is an owner neglect problem more than a self-bailing vs bilge pump problem. That’s not even digging into why the boat was sinking issue.

I think one bilge pump was all there was! Yes, you are right, it was an owner problem. Not just neglect but also lack of knowledge & poor judgement. That doesn't speak well of my judgement going out with this guy! What can be learned from this? First, if your bilge pump keeps coming on, find out why! Obviously, the boat would have sank due to the fact it was taking on water. I wouldn't blame it on the choice of systems as I seriously doubt the bilge pump was designed for an emergency like this. Had the bilge pump(s) been adequate for the job, this would not have happened. Also, scuppers would likely have drained the water on deck effectively enough for the boat to make it back to port. I don't recall seeing any but if it had them, they were inadequate. My take on this is either pumps or scuppers will do the job if properly engineered. My boat has both & I am not planning to get rid of either!