Boat fire

[Genius]

I agree with the CG, not having a night watch was the primary reason for the deaths. They skirted the rules for years, and chance finally caught up to them.

Looking online I see that the captain was charged, but no word on the conviction. Perhaps the case is still working it's way through the courts.

it's not the root cause. Tell me what he could have done?

 

[Downrigga]

it's not the root cause. Tell me what he could have done?

Installed more electrical outlets. That boat was built before we all had cell phones that needed to be charged maybe?

 

[ArchHibb]

Whatever the reason for the fire, there must’ve been an unintentional accelerant involved to engulf the boat that quickly and, if initiated in the ER, overwhelm the fire suppression system. Spraying hydraulic oil ignited by an exhaust manifold is one that comes to mind.

 

[hunttr]

Not necessarily an accelerant involved at least initially.If there was a deck watch that person could have put the fire out simply by unpluging the charger or with an extinguisher before it got out of hand.The fire went undetected for who knows how long because everyone was sleeping.By the time a crew member was woken up by the sounds of a fire out of control it was to late.

 

[Downrigga]

I think we are talking about two different fires. Regardless, i have been on the water all my life. Not much scares me but a fire on a fiberglass boat? That scares the shit out of me. You have no time and you better jump off the right side of the boat. I saw a regulator burn to the water line in nantucket harbor. The fire was out of control in a flash.

 

[ccc]

it's not the root cause. Tell me what he could have done?

Smelled / sensed something funny, checked it out, and unplugged things, at best? Next best would be extinguish a smoldering fire. At worst, woken everyone up and gotten them off the boat.

Same thing a watch stander would do in any ‘situation;’ notice it and act accordingly.

 

[hunttr]

While there was fiberglass involved that boat (Conception) was mostly wood.The hull was plywood with a glass skin on the outside.

 

[Genius]

Smelled / sensed something funny, checked it out, and unplugged things, at best? Next best would be extinguish a smoldering fire. At worst, woken everyone up and gotten them off the boat.

Same thing a watch stander would do in any ‘situation;’ notice it and act accordingly.

Maybe(s) and possibly(s) aren't root cause. While I agree that it may have prevented the incident, it's not the root cause. Just like the new law in RI about gun ownership, maybe it could have prevented the killing incident in Texas if the individual was 21...

As Downrigga mentioned, we may be talking about two different incidents. I'm referring to the dive boat incident with charging devices that caught fire while the passengers were sleeping in their bunks. Think they were at anchor during night hours.

The regulation required a deck watch. No smoke detection, no detex clock rounds, no automatic extinguishing systems. There was only one way out of the berthing space, and the fire was in the way of that exit. The T boat, didn't even have a general alarm bell most likely, how to wake up individuals in a space that isn't accessible. The fire to my understanding was a Lithium Ion battery fire, can't put those out with ABC fire extinguishers.

My point is....it's very easy to blame the operator when it really isn't the real issue.

 

[hunttr]

Couple of things (Conception), There was a small hatch in the forward part of the bunk room for use as an emergency exit but was not used for whatever reason.Also while a fire extinguisher might not put out the battery itself you could certainly keep the fire in check if caught in time.
I've spent a whole lot of time doing those deck watches at night mostly while underway with 50-60 passengers down below.I've also listened to the CG put out a Pan-Pan for a passenger missing from this boat or that boat more then a couple of times so I was determined that would not happen on this boat on my watch.
It's easy to get complacent when your in a quiet cove at night but things can happen and fair or not fair the Captain is responsible for everyone on board.

 

[Scooby]

Are they going to pull that Marlow up and try to find what happened? As well as get all the fuel and junk out of the ocean? Seems it must be in pretty shallow water if near 2KR buoy.

 

[c1steve]

Installed more electrical outlets. That boat was built before we all had cell phones that needed to be charged maybe?

No, most likely a lithium battery caught fire. The boat's wiring is usually correctly protected by circuit breakers.
Cannister style dive lights have very large batteries, and lithium batteries are not uncommon.

The underlying cause for the fire would have been charging batteries down below. The cause of the deaths is mostly from not having a night watch.

 

[Roccus7]

What I can’t figure out is what’s left to the NH/ME yacht? News last night said owner was looking to hire a salvage firm. Possibly a safe with valuables??

 

[ccc]

Maybe(s) and possibly(s) aren't root cause. While I agree that it may have prevented the incident, it's not the root cause. Just like the new law in RI about gun ownership, maybe it could have prevented the killing incident in Texas if the individual was 21...

As Downrigga mentioned, we may be talking about two different incidents. I'm referring to the dive boat incident with charging devices that caught fire while the passengers were sleeping in their bunks. Think they were at anchor during night hours.

The regulation required a deck watch. No smoke detection, no detex clock rounds, no automatic extinguishing systems. There was only one way out of the berthing space, and the fire was in the way of that exit. The T boat, didn't even have a general alarm bell most likely, how to wake up individuals in a space that isn't accessible. The fire to my understanding was a Lithium Ion battery fire, can't put those out with ABC fire extinguishers.

My point is....it's very easy to blame the operator when it really isn't the real issue.

So are you saying if we took the batteries out of the equation, there would not have been an incident and nobody would have died?

 

[ccc]

(Offer of a beer comes with all these comments, I hope that’s a given…)

 

[Genius]

So are you saying if we took the batteries out of the equation, there would not have been an incident and nobody would have died?

Basically yes. The type of battery, the charging set up or whatever caused the fire is the root issue. Maybe the regulations haven’t caught up to the technology?

 

[goin4broke]

The best or worst made battery can catch fire. That’s the “maybe”. Regardless of what started the fire on the Conception the fact is a watchman would have saved lives. That’s the “definite”

 

[Genius]

The best or worst made battery can catch fire. That’s the “maybe”. Regardless of what started the fire on the Conception the fact is a watchman would have saved lives. That’s the “definite”

I don't think that's necessarily true, but anyway...there is a large potential of energy stored in any battery. Ships have them in lockers designed for the dangers. Even more dangers associated with charging and using Lithium Ion batteries IMO.

A watchman "would" have saved lives? Or "may" have? Speculating IMO.

Root cause analysis in accident investigation was valuable training acquired in my oilfield days. Kelvin Topset course is the one I went through. Of course "I" don't have all the facts like the investigation team had.

 

[CaptMD]

Lithium Ion batteries, those are what's in all the cordless tools we have, yes? Should I be concerned about them in my house or garage?

 

[Crusty Coastie]

What I can’t figure out is what’s left to the NH/ME yacht? News last night said owner was looking to hire a salvage firm. Possibly a safe with valuables??

He's required by his insurance company

Lithium Ion batteries, those are what's in all the cordless tools we have, yes? Should I be concerned about them in my house or garage?

Yep,pull the plug on the charger when not around.I've come to the job site a few times early AM to find them in the charger hot as hell.

 

[TCL]

We have two Lithium Ion batteries on the 787 they are in closed in Titanium box‘s that are secured with 65 bolts, it takes close to two hours to change a battery.